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Old 07-05-2007, 02:02 PM   #1
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Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Two San Antonio area parks, Friedrich Wilderness Park & Crownridge Canyon Park, are closed for one week's time while the city determines if there is/are mountain lion(s) at the parks.

More info here...

Let's hope if they do find the mountain lion(s), they don't KILL THEM like they just killed the 9-foot alligator that'd been spotted (and rather ineptly attempted to be corralled by local PD) in the past on the Southside of S.A. The gator smashed a PD patrol car but mostly just sent officers scurrying as is slid down an embankment and away from the roadside. Today however it was attracting pedestrian attention as it sunned on another nearby roadside. We've had flooding rains here so it's probably had more free range than usual.... but now it's dead, shot by local game wardens.
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Old 07-07-2007, 05:25 AM   #2
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Here is a possible print I found near the two parks. Apparently two tracks on top of each other. Rough country, hard ground with little topsoil. What made me think it was possibly a cougar was the rounded toes and size. No claws like a dog. Didn't think about adding something for scale but this image had to be cropped to be accepted anyway. Ultimately, it's an interesting maybe.

I spent three months in the Sierra Madre mountains in Mexico with a ranch hand who taught me a few things. We looked for bear but the area had it share of cats.

I heard about mountain lions being in the Helotes and Scenic Loop area 25 years ago. I don't find it too hard to believe that there are few around. Leon Valley is not just a catchy name ; )

From everything I've seen and read they're ghosts. Besides there is plenty of deer and other wildlife to eat. So as for what the city is going to do? How about slowing down or stopping the leveling off of hilltops in the area? I'd be more worried about getting hit by a car jogging down the road than being attacked by a mountain lion.

JMP
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Last edited by sagebrush : 07-07-2007 at 05:31 AM.
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Old 07-07-2007, 11:35 PM   #3
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sagebrush View Post


From everything I've seen and read they're ghosts. Besides there is plenty of deer and other wildlife to eat.
If only that were true. There might be plenty of natural prey for the big cats in the area, but if they're becoming more and more in contact with humans in the park, it's only a matter of time before they're acclimated to the presence of humans. Then some mom and her small child get stalked by one of cougars like what was happening in the Boot Canyon area of Big Bend last year, and it's only a matter of time before it's an unfortunate end for the animal.
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Old 07-09-2007, 09:33 AM   #4
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

There is an interesting book on the issues regarding the complex relationship between humans and cougars - The Beast in the Garden: A Modern Parable of Man and Nature by David Baron


From Publishers Weekly

In 1991, in Idaho Springs, Colo., a small town not far from Boulder, a young jogger was killed and partially eaten by a mountain lion. Although people were horrified, biologist Michael Sanders and naturalist Jim Halfpenny were not surprised. Since 1988 they had been studying the mountain lions that were invading backyards in the Boulder area in increasing numbers and had concluded that, contrary to the accepted wisdom that these lions don't attack people, the big cats were indeed stalking humans in search of a good meal. In an engrossing book that reads like a true crime thriller, Baron, a science and environmental writer, follows the advance of mountain lions around Boulder as if they were serial killers, building tension as he leads up to the killing. There were plenty of warnings. Numerous homeowners saw lions in their yards, dogs were maimed or eaten and a girl was attacked but survived. Sanders and Halfpenny tried to convince the wildlife-loving Boulderites that a tragedy was about to occur, but people believed they could coexist peacefully with the lions, and the Colorado Division of Wildlife was also determined to leave the animals alone. Even after Scott Lancaster, the Idaho Springs jogger, was killed, area residents refused to endorse killing the big cats that moved into their neighborhoods. Baron is not in favor of killing unwanted lions, but in this timely book he warns that as people continue to displace wild animals from their habitats, they have to change the way they interact with them and be more realistic about romantic notions of wilderness. - Copyright 2003 Reed Business Information, Inc.
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Old 07-09-2007, 02:34 PM   #5
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

We just got back from visiting my in-laws at Canyon Lake & saw the alligator being shot on the SA news. What a shock to see that! There was an alligator shot in Plano in a creek but they think it was a "pet" & someone let it go.

Do you think it has to do with the weather on seeing animals that we normally don't see in the city? A news article several months back stated how mountain lions & bobcats from California were traveling east due to all the fires there.
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Old 07-09-2007, 10:27 PM   #6
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Rick,

Sounds like an interesting read, thanks. I like that the title includes man and nature. You take away nature and man (people) wouldn't be around long or at least want to.

When I took a look on a whim it was pure luck if in the period of hour and half I found a possible track of a cougar. To me it looked like whatever it was stepped down (rock ledge) with it's front paw, then the rear paw planted in front of it. I wanted the exercise, needed some ideas for painting, some photo ops.

From my experience with the parks its more of dusk to dawn getaway for the animals. You get semi feral turkeys during the day, squirrels. Oppossums and armadillos in the low light hours. During the day you notice a lot of rooting done by feral hogs, or javelina's.

IMO the animals don't live in the park proper, instead the less accessible edges and adjacent private back country. As for the Fredreich incident I'd imagine the animal felt its exit was blocked. Passable trails are few and if you make your living through stealth crashing down a hillside isn’t in your comfort level.

In an hour an half I worked my way up a near inpenetrable rocky hillside. With bad socks the first time, I pretty much lost the skin on the back of my heels Long sleeved shirt was a smart choice, because you had to push, crawl, cut through the underbrush when you weren't following the game trails. The game trails are circuitous and correspond with rock ledges and paths of flooding run off.

As you approach the more open sanctuary of the top you spook the animals there whose departure sounds like boulders rolling down a hill. That first day I heard what I expect was three deer spook separately. Soon after the brush opened up to plateau of various cactus, grass, small trees, flat rock, lichen and pooled water.

Trip 1 wildlife inventory

3 deer
1 hog or javelina? Didn’t see it above the underbrush, just heard something that had to weight at least 40 pounds charge down the rocky hillside. (Droppings and large rooting areas)

Trip 2

1 deer
1 unidentified animal skulked away from my auto near dark

Trip 3

9am nothing


Trip 4

1 deer
1 armadillo

The only sign of people along the way was some cut branches probably used for surveying and an older oxidized aluminum CO2 cartridge used in air rifles. All of these far below the plateau. It was a sanctuary that not many domestic animals would bother with.

I toured this area 4 times. The first 3 times regardless of how I thought I might be covering new ground I passed 3 of the same landmarks. A decomposing red balloon that looked like blood, a pool of water captured in a rock that had a vague cat like print in the sediment and a golf ball that had practice printed on it. Bottom line there were very few passable trails in or out.

Not far from civilization yet highly compartmentalized nonetheless. Close enough that a house placed on a overlook could drive golf balls to the area.

I bought my house in the area because my research showed that the city had purchased much of the area for conservation purposes. It also backs up to 1,500 undeveloped acres.

However, in the period of a year and half three major hilltops have been leveled and developed for high end communities. This area has one of the highest densities of deer per acre in the state. Population control is mostly by automobile. However, there are packs of coyotes which work the edges of the 1500 acres. Cleanup is handled by a squadron of buzzards you can see on a private cellular tower erected by a doctor on Scenic Loop road.

I don’t doubt the rain has displaced a number of animals. My grandmother used to talk about all manner of creatures which would be found on higher ground in Rockport after hurricanes. The riverbeds that I would scout for cretaceous fossils are mostly likely difficult to navigate. They have a few small overhangs and minor caverns.

I fish a lot, used to hunt almost continuously as a kid growing up in Helotes. One thing I know is the more game encounters humans or human sign the more likely they will avoid that area for a time.

When I fish, I fish the areas adjacent to popular areas. I used to fish a jetty on Cape Cod the first part of Jetty you could see fish but you couldn’t catch them. I waded across a broken section and like magic your arms would get weary from catching the educated fish.

When I added a second motion activated light on my property the deer found other areas for sanctuary. I still get deer on my flat roof from time to time. My house is cut into a hillside. I’ve walked around and met them. You can also hear their distinctive walk. They take a step pause and listen. Why walk on the roof. It's a nice view : )

So based on the terrain, the nature of mountain lions, I find it unlikely that any definitive sign will be found by biking and hikingaround the public trails on the parks. There are still a number of semi contiguous areas that a mountain lion could range.

As for statistics see the attached document. Statistics are bookmarked.

http://tchester.org/sgm/lists/lion_attacks.html

Last edited by sagebrush : 07-09-2007 at 11:08 PM.
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Old 07-17-2007, 12:04 PM   #7
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Any word on when these parks will be reopened?
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Old 07-18-2007, 01:57 PM   #8
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Our friends have a home in Helotes that backs up to Government Canyon. They saw a mountain lion in their backyard/driveway several months ago. They have 5 young children and were pretty shocked since they just moved from Boston! Their dog chased after it, and they didn't expect him to come back. But he did and he was fine. Apparently, skunks/raccoons had been getting into their trash and the mountain lion was hunting them.
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Old 07-21-2007, 10:47 PM   #9
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

I don't have more current information, but as of July 12th Friedrich Park and Crownridge Canyon were still closed due the possible mountain lion sightings, and a third park -- Eisenhower Park -- had also been closed (Source: KSAT 12 News). Per the referenced report, "City officials said the park(s) will remain closed until an appropriate course of action can be decided."
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Old 07-24-2007, 02:23 PM   #10
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

All three parks have now reopened. If the mountain lions are found, they will be caught and relocated to a wildlife sanctuary, per news reports.
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Old 07-30-2007, 02:29 PM   #11
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

My FIL who lives near Canyon Lake said the SA news said there had been spottings of black bear around San Antonio. Anyone heard of that?
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Old 07-30-2007, 04:54 PM   #12
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

I live in San Antonio and haven't heard anything of that sort. Alligators and mountain lions are the only critters that have been in our local news.
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Old 07-31-2007, 06:20 AM   #13
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

in a newspaper report about a year or two ago they talked about blackbears making a comeback in texas. there have been bear spoted in bexar county and out laying counties just very rarely.
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Old 08-01-2007, 01:05 PM   #14
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

It is my understanding that Black Bears prefer a more humid climate and will shy away from the "desert" type environment around SA and the Hill Country. I could be wrong, though. When I lived in Louisiana, a sugar cane farmer friend of mine was shocked to see a Black Bear on one of his farms and went to his house, got a shotgun and shot it. Two weeks later, Federal Wildlife and Fisheries came down and asked him questions about the incident and arrested him. I don't know what came of that.

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Old 08-01-2007, 11:24 PM   #15
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Re: Mountain Lions in San Antonio?

Oh my! But the only place I've been that is more humid than San Antonio is Houston. SA is definitely humid. We lived there 8 years. Desert is like Phoenix AZ. I imagine there could be bears hanging out somewhere.
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